LU to Sunbelt??

[jdcurran235]

And even that is questionable if it really has to be met. IE Idaho is still FBS.

[jdcurran235]

Another school that the SBC seems to be in love with and is "ready" is Missouri State. Don't see where MSU is greater than LU. Larger enrollment but smaller endowment. Similar fan support and equivalent football. Springfield MSA is same as Beaumont MSA except we are close to Houston. Just don't get it when they are throwing around candidates names. Lamar is undersold. JMHO

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missouri_State_University

[jdcurran235]

Another question is what does it mean to be "ready". When the SBC posters say the SHSU and Lamar are not "ready" but MSU is, what makes MSU ready and other schools not ready? What is the pedigree of a good add so to speak?

[jdcurran235]

http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2013/05/realignment_continues_to_domin.html

 

[LUSportsFan]

Another school that the SBC seems to be in love with and is "ready" is Missouri State. Don't see where MSU is greater than LU.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missouri_State_University

 

Just did an attendance comparison in Football.

 

Missouri State averaged 9,514 from 2010-2012.

 

For comparison, below are the highest average attendance amounts for SLC universities for the same period. We know about our home schedules. For example, we'll never see an FBS program at home while playing in FCS. Substitute Langston, McMurry, Texas College, etc with some of the OOC opponents shown on the Sun Belt list below, and I'm sure that attendance would see a bump regardless of the home team's record.

 

McNeese 12,678. (6-5, 6-5, 7-4)

Lamar 13,880. (5-6, 4-7, 4-8)

Central Arkansas 9,168. (7-4, 9-4, 9-3)

 

I also looked at attendance for established SBC programs using the same three year period.

 

University 3 Year Average Noteable Out of Conference Home Games

FAU 15,016 Michigan State - 2010

FIU 17,284 Rutgers - 2010, Duke - 2011, Louisville - 2012

WKU 16,210 Indiana - 2010, Navy - 2011, Southern Miss - 2012

MTSU 18,390 Minnesota - 2010, Georgia Tech - 2011, Memphis - 2011

NT 18,503 Kansas St - 2010, Rice - 2010, Indiana - 2011, Houston - 2011

Troy 19,266 Mississippi St - 2012, Navy - 2012

UL 23,140 Oklahoma St - 2010

ULM 20,476 Arkansas - 2010, Arkansas - 2012, Baylor - 2012

ArkSt 21,683 Louisville - 2010, Memphis - 2011, Memphis - 2012

 

I think just about any University in our conference could greatly increase average attendance with some of the above Out of Conference opponents in our stadiums. We did set our record attendance when Baylor visited us in 1980.

[jdcurran235]

I bet the SBC does not expand this year. I think JMU is out for this year, and MSU is not wanting to move up yet. Lamar would accept if invited but they will not get the invite and JSU is not ready. I bet they dont add anyone this year and wait for schools to be more prepared and more dominos to fall. The SBC needs to hope that there is not a total collapse with another conference shift and they become the the next conference to lose football.

[LUSportsFan]

Another question is what does it mean to be "ready". When the SBC posters say the SHSU and Lamar are not "ready" but MSU is, what makes MSU ready and other schools not ready? What is the pedigree of a good add so to speak?

 

This has puzzled me as well.

 

Academically, we're in the same category and in the same grouping of the US News ranking as 7 of the current universities and 3 of the future universities. We (and SHSU) are ranked as National Universities along with FIU, FAU, MTSU, USA, UALR, UL, and NT as well as GaSo, GaSt, and UTA.

 

As a Doctoral Research University, we're in the same category as UALR and GaSo. UL, GaSt, and UTA are DRU, but are High Research or Very High Research Universities, a step higher than us. The remaining current or future members are classified as Masters Level universities.

 

Enrollment - Our enrollment is near or above 5 of the remaining Universities and is growing.

 

Endowment - At a 2011 amount of $69,446 Million Lamar would have the third highest endowment in Conference behind Texas State ($119,711 Million) and Appalachian State ($69,551 Million) according to the National Association of College and University Business Officers survey. (Note: No reference for UL, ULM, UTA, UALR so those may be combined with their system funds.) Since the survey is two years old and we're in the last year of our Investing for the Future Campaign, I would expect our endowment to be higher unless there were some big draw downs.

 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

We compare favorably with athletics facilities except for our Football stadium capacity. The last football stadium renovation took care of all the accessibility requirements for new construction so future expansion for us should be less expensive than it would be for other Universities.

 

Basketball - The Montagne Center is larger than all but two arenas of remaining and future Universities at 10,080. (UL - 12,068 and ArkSt - 10,563)

 

Baseball - Vincent-Beck is larger than all but two stadiums of remaining and future Universities at 3,500 (UL - 3,755 and USA - 4,500)

 

The Dauphin Athletic Complex is in operation. Other Universities are building or planning complexes of similar use and size.

 

Sports - We already compete in every sport offered in the SBC except Swimming & Diving and only 5 Universities offer those sports.

 

I would like to see our Engineering and Business schools score higher in the US News and World Report survey. Our online program is ranked with Online Nursing at #2. I would like to see more research; maybe leveraging the industry in our local area.

 

 

 

[coachacola]

I think by not ready they mean that Lamar's athletic budget is low and the football stadium is too small. I don't know where the funds would come from to enlarge the stadium, aren't they still trying to raise money for both the softball and baseball stadiums? They can't even seem to be able to raise enough donations to upgrade the very outdated scoreboard in the Montagne Center.

[LUSportsFan]

Agree.

 

We could steal the Daktronics scoreboard SHSU recently announced for their Baseball stadium. :)

http://www.gobearkats.com/ViewArticle.dbml?ATCLID=207503267

[jdcurran235]

I think by not ready they mean that Lamar's athletic budget is low and the football stadium is too small. I don't know where the funds would come from to enlarge the stadium, aren't they still trying to raise money for both the softball and baseball stadiums? They can't even seem to be able to raise enough donations to upgrade the very outdated scoreboard in the Montagne Center.

 

Is it to low? It would be in the bottom 3rd of the SBC schools but within the range of all the schools. And I thought we had received all the money for softball and that it was just the scoreboard and baseball stadium that we were still raising money for. And we need to look at the full scope of what they are raising money for in the Montagne. I thought there were stadium upgrades along with the scoreboard going on?

[jdcurran235]

I know that SHSU fans are against moving up, but I personally would love to see SHSU move up. I think it gives the TSUS more clout politically and I think a yearly game at reliant with SHSU would be huge especially if we were both FBS schools. Also I think they are more ready than most people on this site gives them credit for. The TSUS schools have really done well in the last ten years, they have pulled resources together, and I think it is just the next step for all three schools. Texas will continue to grow and so will the schools.

[LUSportsFan]

Agree with everything you are saying. I think the system Universities can get further faster working and competing together.

 

There are some really good things going on with TxSt, SHSu, and LU.

 

From my Android device using Tapatalk 2

 

 

[jdcurran235]

Brent Thibodeaux ‏ @ BrentThibodeaux 7m

All signs pointing towards no invite before June 1, look for the # SunBelt to explore options for a 2015 invite to a 12th football member.

 

Brent Thibodeaux ‏ @ BrentThibodeaux 9m

With # JMU out of the equation, # Liberty is the only viable option for a # SunBelt invite. Members will not unite for Liberty, at this time.

 

Brent Thibodeaux ‏ @ BrentThibodeaux 11m

On May 20, # SunBelt current Pres & ADs will meet to discuss all options. An agreement on a potential invite is looking bleak at this stage.

[jdcurran235]

Brent Thibodeaux ‏@BrentThibodeaux 5m

@WACspartypants 0% for 2014. 10% for 2015. It would take Lamar securing funds, getting board approval, declaring for FBS & big alum backing

[coachacola]

Gary Johnson ‏@SunBeltInsider

No names has been mention for expansion options. But Benson said there are several options out there.

 

 

Gary Johnson ‏@SunBeltInsider

Commissioner Benson also said the conference is looking to add 1-2 additional bowl tie-ins in 2014.

 

 

Gary Johnson ‏@SunBeltInsider

According to CommissionerBenson the Sun Belt Conference is looking for another program similar to Ga Southern & Appalachian St.

 

 

Gary Johnson ‏@SunBeltInsider

A Sun Belt Conference decision on addiing one more member to get to 12, will be made during annual spring meetings in Destin, FL.

[coachacola]

Brent Thibodeaux ‏@BrentThibodeaux I'll be talking #SunBelt Conference realignment today with @GametimeMickey at 3:15 CST. Click the link to listen live http://www.953theticket.com

[Guest Crawfish]

The attendance numbers for ULM include 2 "home games" against Arkansas at Little Rock. These were scheduled as a 10 year package when the NCAA threatened to force teams down that did not maintain 15K in attendance. That contract is now over.

 

As far as endowments, UL is around 150M. It has bounced around at that level for several years now. I do not think endowments are a make or break thing though, unless there is a sizeable athletic endowment.

 

Personally, I think Lamar's leadership may not be pushing very hard for SBC membership. I may be wrong, but I have not heard of such a push from some people I know who should be in the know on this. Of course part of this may be a result of Dr. Simmons's retirement. Maybe he wanted to leave strategic decisions like this to his replacement? Lamar is certainly close to the level of some in the conference and ahead of others (like ULM). That said, the leadership at Lamar must make a hard push if they wish to move up. There are too many others looking from the outside in.

 

[LUSportsFan]

The attendance numbers for ULM include 2 "home games" against Arkansas at Little Rock. These were scheduled as a 10 year package when the NCAA threatened to force teams down that did not maintain 15K in attendance. That contract is now over.

 

As far as endowments, UL is around 150M. It has bounced around at that level for several years now. I do not think endowments are a make or break thing though, unless there is a sizeable athletic endowment.

 

Personally, I think Lamar's leadership may not be pushing very hard for SBC membership. I may be wrong, but I have not heard of such a push from some people I know who should be in the know on this. Of course part of this may be a result of Dr. Simmons's retirement. Maybe he wanted to leave strategic decisions like this to his replacement? Lamar is certainly close to the level of some in the conference and ahead of others (like ULM). That said, the leadership at Lamar must make a hard push if they wish to move up. There are too many others looking from the outside in.

 

Thanks for the clarifications about UL and ULM.

 

I agree that endowments aren't a make or break. They are just another factor in trying to determine "how high of a bar one needs to jump" and one indicator of support. By the way, I found a more recent source listing endowment total changes from 2011-2012. According to the source, below are some revised amounts.

 

University Endowment Amount (Millions $)

Lamar 76,935

 

Texas State 118,570

Appalachian St 72,183

Troy University 32,873

Georgia State 112,140

Georgia Southern 38,197

Western Kentucky 111,043

North Texas 112,594

Arkansas State 39,408

 

Missouri State 61,166

James Madison 59,578

 

https://chronicle.com/article/Endowments/136933/

 

While the source link provides a lot of information, I think it may not be complete. For example, only three Louisiana university systems are included. The list is compiled from the National Association of College and Business Fund Officers and Commonfund Institute and includes 833 entries.

 

I think you may be correct about not pushing very hard. If there is a push, it is a very quiet push. We've heard very little.

 

In an attempt to minimize my personal bias, I think the Sun Belt Conference needs to use every advantage of being one of the last remaining paths in a move to FBS. Except for a calamitous worst case scenario turning into reality as the WAC experienced, the Sun Belt can afford to be picky. I'm just concerned about misconceptions uninformed people may have about my university. Lamar has changed a lot for the better during Dr. Simmons's presidency. There are a lot of good things going on.

[Bearkat 41]

I know that SHSU fans are against moving up, but I personally would love to see SHSU move up. I think it gives the TSUS more clout politically and I think a yearly game at reliant with SHSU would be huge especially if we were both FBS schools. Also I think they are more ready than most people on this site gives them credit for. The TSUS schools have really done well in the last ten years, they have pulled resources together, and I think it is just the next step for all three schools. Texas will continue to grow and so will the schools.

 

Not all fans are against a "move up". I for one think SHSU should jump asap at this point. The Southland is dying and is "bad" across the board in all sports on a national level so NCAA at large bids for sports like baseball are going to be harder to earn. Not to mention when you add in the D-2 schools to the mix. I sure hope SHSU gets it done even though I acknowledge that it will have an impact on football. The reward outweighs the risk in my opinion.

[Guest kakat10]

The tide seems to be shifting amongst Sam Houston fans not only on KF.com but around Huntsville and the University. I think most people are seeing the SLC for what it is becoming, a watered down FCS conference. The match ups against Houston Baptist, etc. just don't cut it. I am hearing chatter that Sam Houston AD and Administration are getting the pieces lined up and are quietly trying to make a move. We will

see where it goes.

[coachacola]

I'm still sticking with my prediction that LU and SHSU move to the Sun Belt at the same time in a few years.

[Guest Crawfish]

This could get things moving again! If C-USA takes 2 more, it will probably come from the Belt.

 

http://www.thenewsstar.com/article/20130510/SPORTS/305100023/CUSA-commish-likes-16-team-league-won-t-guarantee-it?nclick_check=1

[TexGator]

A comparison look at the 15 schools contacted by the Sun Belt for possible membership.

 

width=500 height=329http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-xW-cO5ZMui8/US_28zBgXpI/AAAAAAAAB4c/Tv25NdnWMv0/s1600/Untitled.jpg[/img]

 

I love the chart. But, the chart isn't fully accurate. Lamar doesn't bring in the Houston market. The Houston Chronicle has 50 articles, videos, and other items on their College Sports page... none of them even mention the Southland Conference- let alone Lamar.

 

I love my Cardinals, but we're not part of the Houston market any more than Liberty University brings in the D.C. market.

[TexGator]

Another question is what does it mean to be "ready". When the SBC posters say the SHSU and Lamar are not "ready" but MSU is, what makes MSU ready and other schools not ready? What is the pedigree of a good add so to speak?

 

What makes a school "ready to move up"?

-Administration supporting potential move

-Athletic leadership committing to process of move

-University community support for improved facilities (i.e. boosters who have already committed to writing big checks)

-Student support for move through potential of student fee for facilities

 

So, the new prez (who is a Business/Marketing prof) will need to talk to the movers and shakers in the oil industry and see what fruit is left on the trees... $40M for P-U-S renovations would be good. There's still room to expand UP and OUT w/o much worry. The problem is that the Montagne limits north side options other than just adding about 1000 seats bowling around (which would be a good place for more student seating to deafen the other team when running plays).

[jdcurran235]

Another question is what does it mean to be "ready". When the SBC posters say the SHSU and Lamar are not "ready" but MSU is, what makes MSU ready and other schools not ready? What is the pedigree of a good add so to speak?

 

What makes a school "ready to move up"?

-Administration supporting potential move

-Athletic leadership committing to process of move

-University community support for improved facilities (i.e. boosters who have already committed to writing big checks)

-Student support for move through potential of student fee for facilities

 

So, the new prez (who is a Business/Marketing prof) will need to talk to the movers and shakers in the oil industry and see what fruit is left on the trees... $40M for P-U-S renovations would be good. There's still room to expand UP and OUT w/o much worry. The problem is that the Montagne limits north side options other than just adding about 1000 seats bowling around (which would be a good place for more student seating to deafen the other team when running plays).

 

I doubt community support is really a big issue for Lamar, I think it is probably more of an administrative support issue. But maybe our donations have dried up. Its hard to tell. I would think if the school really pushed for it, then it would happen. And that takes admin support which i am not sure we have at this point. I would think student support is there after the vote on the SETZ.