WAC's additions - Southern Utah, Stephen F. Austin, SHSU, Lamar, Abilene Christian

[robertobutler]

According to Matt Brown via Twitter, the WAC's official additions of Southern Utah, Sam Houston State, Lamar, Abilene Christian and Stephen F. Austin will be finalized in the next two weeks.

[lamarfan360]

According to Matt Brown via Twitter, the WAC's official additions of Southern Utah, Sam Houston State, Lamar, Abilene Christian and Stephen F. Austin will be finalized in the next two weeks.

 

I've heard there are problems in the athletic budget's among Louisiana school's in the SLC. So, there may be some meat to this rumor.

Edited December 8, 2020 by lamarfan360

[geezer]

Unless the Louisiana schools can't financially keep going what is the advantage for these five schools. Can the WAC restart a football conference as an FBS Conference? If not will New Mexico State drop to FCS or will they continue to play FBS Independent. Only three of the existing nine member schools play football. Two of those are transitioning to Division 1. Scheduling and travel will increase Lamar expenses. Potential positives the football playing schools are the farthest east schools of the members. An eight team football conference would allow for four non conference games a year. Unless the WAC can be an FBS conference it doesn't change who Lamar can schedule for home games. FBS schools, I believe are still prevented from traveling to FCS or smaller schools. Could a brand new conference decide to be FBS? If so then these five schools might be better off to form a new conference and invite the three football schools from the WAC to join them. That would make travel expenses more tolerable. Edited December 8, 2020 by geezer

[puddin tane]

We get 6k-8k in the stands for natural rivals. Why does anybody think playing teams out west and in utah is a good thing? “ oh..it’ll be FBS”. Big fricking whoop. “ oh, but look at the exposure coastal carolina and ul-l are getting”. Thats cuz of covid. During a regular year, nobody gives a rats ass about the sunbelt, conference usa or the mac.

 

there are more teams losing big bucks in fbs that should drop than fcs teams that should go up.

 

are we gonna get more fans by playing tarelton state, dixie state, and ut rio grande than we get now? Nope nope and nope

 

Stay in the Southland

[lamarfan360]

[geezer]

I won't say that I'm in favor of moving to FBS or even changing conferences, but you might get more fans in the stands if you could play ULL, ULM, La Tech or Rice and other old rivals potentially in Bmt. As I stated in earlier, if my memory is correct those schools can't schedule a game at an FCS schools home site. Mean while the announcement of home and home with Texas Southern is a plus. Oh yeah the WAC is not currently a football conference and the only football schools in the WAC are New Mexico St, an FBS Independent, Tarleton State and Dixie State. I don't know that I would want to be in the Southland if SFA, Sam and ACU leave. Edited December 9, 2020 by geezer

[puddin tane]

https://www.theadvertiser.com/story/sports/college/ul/2019/11/29/ul-football-ragin-cajuns-address-attendance-problem/4276008002/

 

thats during ull’s best season in school history

 

ul-m draws about the same as Deweyville.

 

they gotta compete with Lsu for fans. We got ut, aggy and LSU

 

Too many games on tv for people to sit and watch.

 

Grass aint always greener

[coachacola]

More confirmation, this time noting the baseball programs....

 

[tweet]1337076375002505219[/tweet]

[coachacola]

Here's an article from Dave Campbell's Texas Football website....

 

https://www.texasfootball.com/article/2020/12/09/four-texas-colleges-expected-to-join-western-athletic-conference

 

It'll be a FCS conference and a better basketball conference for sure.

[lamarfan360]

Here is another read regarding the WAC.

 

https://www.wachoopsdigest.com/college-football-returning-to-the-wac-expansion-talks-heat-up/

[geezer]

Travel expenses would go up considerably and the loss of the McNeese rivalry are the big negatives. The other apparent consideration athletically as mentioned in one of the attached articles is at least two years of no automatic conference berth to the football playoffs unless New Mexico State is ready to drop to FCS from a FBS Independent. The automatic playoff berth might not be that big of deal assuming that with seven football playing schools each school would have five non-conference games to schedule. Assuming you fill those with FCS or FBS schools the four Texas schools should have enough quality games to be considered for an at large berth. With the loss of four football schools in the Southland that would open up several schools to fill the non-conference schedule. The other question is are there academic advantages to a move.

[lamarfan360]

Here is another interesting article.

 

https://extrapoints.substack.com/p/the-latest-on-the-return-of-the-wac

[geezer]

Question on NCAA FBS/FCS rules? Assuming I am correct and FBS schools aren't allowed to play road games at an FCS institution, if LU were to play Rice or any other FBS at NRG Park in Houston. would that allow LU to get bigger part of the gate than playing Rice at Rice Stadium? It would technically be a neutral site and allow Lamar to "be the home team". I have no idea if there would be enough fan interest to make it financially better than playing non-conference FCS schools in Beaumont.

[coachacola]

Looking at this from a basketball prospective, here's how Massey is rating the 13 current and future WAC teams:

 

135 Southern Utah (#1 in Big Sky)

140 Abilene Christian (#1 in SLC)

170 New Mexico State (#1 in WAC)

179 SFA (#2 in SLC)

213 Grand Canyon (#2 in WAC)

222 SHSU (#3 in SLC)

237 UTRGV

244 Seattle

286 Dixie State

299 Utah Valley

301 LU

302 Cal Baptist

341 Tarleton State

-----

356 Chicago State (probably leaving)

 

Comparing these ratings to other conferences, the new WAC would jump up around 10 spots to where the Patriot League is rated, around the #22 spot. Not great but a big step up.

 

On a related not, getting rid of Seattle and Cal Baptist would drop the league down to 11 teams, and the conference would be spread over 4 states: Texas, Utah, New Mexico and Arizona. This could be a pretty good mid-level basketball conference, comparable to the Sun Belt and Big West.

[lamarfan360]

Here is a update to the Hoop Scoop article.

 

“There are still a number of moving parts that need to be worked out. No invitations have been officially accepted at this time, but decisions are expected in the next two weeks. No timeline has been set on when these schools would officially join the conference.”

 

It is yet to be determined if the WAC will become an FCS conference or a FBS conference. If the WAC does become an FBS conference, New Mexico State could be that eighth member.

 

https://www.wachoopsdigest.com/college-football-returning-to-the-wac-expansion-talks-heat-up/

Edited December 12, 2020 by lamarfan360

[baller]

I believe the WAC would have a more northern and southern divisions to reduce travel costs.They probably would have most small revenue sports play only within their division and basketball play home and home within the division and only once outside the division.That greatly reduces the increased travel argument.Sam,Lamar and Stephen F.Austin have athletic budgets of about 19 million compared to football playing Louisiana schools 10- 13 million budgets.Playing In a similarly financially committed conference would be a consideration to join the WAC.It would seem to have a better RPI allowing to meet some conference requirements of getting higher paying guarantee games.The Southland was ranked 30 out of 32 in mens basketball.I would support the move given what I currently know.I would applaud Ken Evans and Marco for exploring these options if this pans out.But,new information could make for an updated analysis and decision on this topic.

[geezer]

I doubt there is any chance that the WAC attempts to become an FBS conference with the proposed slate of schools. It may have changed but my memory is that to be an FBS school, average attendance needed to be in the 15k range. Of the proposed schools does anyone have 15k seating capacity beside Lamar? Even if you had capacity, can you fill it? I looked it up and to stay FBS a school must average 15k in either paid or actual attendance every other year. Edited December 12, 2020 by geezer

[robertobutler]

I doubt there is any chance that the WAC attempts to become an FBS conference with the proposed slate of schools. It may have changed but my memory is that to be an FBS school, average attendance needed to be in the 15k range. Of the proposed schools does anyone have 15k seating capacity beside Lamar? Even if you had capacity, can you fill it? I looked it up and to stay FBS a school must average 15k in either paid or actual attendance every other year.

They're very lax on that rule - and I listened to a podcast the other night where the New Mexico St AD alluded to this new WAC becoming an FBS conference within five years or so.

[lamarfan360]

Comments from the NMSU athletic director...

 

New Mexico State athletic director Mario Moccia declined to comment directly on the WAC’s expansion plans Thursday, but he did offer opinions on how such changes could affect NMSU.

“I can’t comment on any active membership situations,” Moccia said, “but in general I think expansion for the WAC is a positive thing. Adding schools would provide stability, which has been an issue for the league, and the possibility of adding football is exciting.”

 

“In terms of football, I understand there’s talk of an FCS league,” Moccia said. “But it would be really exciting if those schools came in with an eye toward reclassifying to FBS in a few years. We’ll just have to see how things play out.”

 

https://www.abqjournal.com/1525741/w...-football.html

[coachacola]

Here's a look at the athletic budgets for LU, SHSU and SFA:

 

#148 SHSU $19.2 million

#150 SFA $19.0 million

#153 LU $18.6 million

 

UCA comes in fourth in the SLC at $14.2 million

ACU is not listed, probably because they're a private school.

 

Incoming Southern Utah is at #179 at $15.4 million

 

Current WAC members (football schools)

#120 New Mexico State $28 million (FBS independent)

#168 Utah Valley $16.4 million

 

Looking at the Sunbelt football schools, their budgets range from $29 to $37 million (except for lowly UL-Monroe at $15.6 million).

 

https://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances/

[BigRed2010]

And so it begins. SFA board of regents recommends the move to the WAC conference July 2nd 2022:

 

Just talked to @rivey35 . No invite has been accepted but the invite is in their hands. The clock starts on negotiations.

Video coming soon. https://t.co/jg89VfV6cL

— Caleb Beames (@CalebKTRE) December 17, 2020

 

https://www.ktre.com/2020/12/17/sfa-board-regents-approves-plans-leave-southland-join-western-athletic-conference/

Edited December 17, 2020 by BigRed2010

[geezer]

SFA would never publicly say this, but is it really a package deal that all four schools move or no one does? It is just a guess but I would be surprised SFA would make a move without some guarantee that at least either LU or Sam was going to move also. I would think a move to the WAC would require mostly air travel and where is the nearest airport capable of planes large enough to carry a football team. I could see ACU make the move solo, as they might benefit expense wise others when you look at travel costs. They currently have long trips to the Louisiana schools. So probably the biggest other question is what kind of football conference does the WAC ultimately want to be?

[lamarfan360]

I thought this was an interesting read regarding a current WAC member.

 

Chicago State suspends men's basketball for the rest of the season.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/ncaafb/chicago-state-suspends-mens-basketball-for-rest-of-season/ar-BB1cbA7M

Edited December 24, 2020 by lamarfan360

[lamarfan360]

I sure miss Billy Tubbs. I remember this old article and talk at that time of joining the WAC.

 

"Yes, we plan to do that, in a five-year program we would like be in the FBS, which is the Bowl Subdivision," Tubbs said. "That's where we aspire to be. As things are moving around, we want to position ourselves to have the possibility of upgrading our football program."

 

https://www.beaumontenterprise.com/sports/lamar/article/Deals-could-mean-bigger-things-for-LU-athletics-732743.php

[BigRed2010]

Sounds like like it's really happening! We will see.........

 

 

WAC Update (1/2)

 

Multiple sources indicate #Texas4 announcement within first 3 weeks of Jan.

 

SLC really wants schools out in ‘21 but currently ‘22. Financials of departure a sticking point on all sides

 

NCAA waivers on FCS AQ (WAC) & SLC sports (Ten / Golf) to be sought

— Katfans.com (@KatFansDotCom) December 30, 2020

Edited December 30, 2020 by BigRed2010