coachacola Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 http://m.panews.com/portarthur/pm_113091/contentdetail.htm?contentguid=51vMrkeU He says a deal to buy out Knight's contract is doable, but is Tic Price the answer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdseye Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 I think I have changed my mind on Pat Knight. I say we let him stay. If he refuses to resign, let him stay. Let him work (I threw up a little) for his money instead of paying him to be some place else. Let him wallow in the mess he has made for TWO more years. Let him continue to stain the name is father made. I was thinking how his dad was around when Pat first arrived here. I can't remember the the last time I have heard Bob's name mentioned around Lamar. Maybe dad has seen enough and does not want to answer the tough questions about his son. So stick around Pat I'm getting my popcorn ready to watch the rest of this disaster movie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geezer Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 West is wrong about getting rid of Knight in the middle of the year. Lamar no longer has a reputation as a good basketball sports program and what decent coach would want to come to a bad program where the school may not honor their contract. Unless Knight has done something unethical firing him during the season would just not help. Being a bad coach is not unethical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badndn Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Anyone else here think Knight is trying to get fired? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingSnake Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Anyone else here think Knight is trying to get fired? I'm with you on that. I think he is not even trying to succeed. I wholeheartedly think he is just waiting for the buyout. I think he is a worthless, thieving piece of excrement. I hope this is the last coaching job he ever has Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austin badbyrd Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 As much as a train wreck this is, I think he should get at least one more year. It took the football team about three years to get close to competitive, so I think he should get one more year. If it doesn't improve or it stays the same, them fire him.The more I look at this team, the more it seems to me that it was a bigger mess last year than i first thought. In reality we can't count the first year because it was Roc's players. After three years it completely becomes his mess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LUSportsFan Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 As much as a train wreck this is, I think he should get at least one more year. It took the football team about three years to get close to competitive, so I think he should get one more year. If it doesn't improve or it stays the same, them fire him.The more I look at this team, the more it seems to me that it was a bigger mess last year than i first thought. In reality we can't count the first year because it was Roc's players. After three years it completely becomes his mess. The question is can we wait without killing the program. It reminds me of the period from Tom Abatemarco's famed sphagetti comments to the coupe de gras during the Tony Branch period. Although winning, Abatemarco alienated the fans. Branch's period finished it off with the losses. Sent from my Android device using Tapatalk 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingSnake Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 As much as a train wreck this is, I think he should get at least one more year. It took the football team about three years to get close to competitive, so I think he should get one more year. If it doesn't improve or it stays the same, them fire him.The more I look at this team, the more it seems to me that it was a bigger mess last year than i first thought. In reality we can't count the first year because it was Roc's players. After three years it completely becomes his mess. The HUGE difference is, the football team was starting from scratch. PK doesn't have that excuse (or reason) He is an abject failure by any measuring stick. And, he has dared the administration to fire him. He doesn't care. Why give him one more minute? Tic Price may not be the long term answer, but he is so much better right now than "the little general" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puddin tane Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 As much as a train wreck this is, I think he should get at least one more year. It took the football team about three years to get close to competitive, so I think he should get one more year. If it doesn't improve or it stays the same, them fire him.The more I look at this team, the more it seems to me that it was a bigger mess last year than i first thought. In reality we can't count the first year because it was Roc's players. After three years it completely becomes his mess. the football program has never been this bad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austin badbyrd Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 All of the above comments I agree with, but lets get real. There's a lot of frustration from all ends - coach, team and fans. True, the football program started from scratch and had a bigger mountain to climb. I believe after last year's debacle, the BB team was in a bigger mess than we ever could imagine. If it wasn't Osas would still be here and there would be no problem in the post. I also believe that when Price left for Grambling and Paulino left for Fresno State, we didn't get as high level of assistants as those two. Price kept Osas motivated and after Price left, Osas went south in a hurry. Maybe it is a combination of poor recruits and inadequate coaching. I think a case can be made for both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cardinalrule Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 All of the above comments I agree with, but lets get real. There's a lot of frustration from all ends - coach, team and fans. True, the football program started from scratch and had a bigger mountain to climb. I believe after last year's debacle, the BB team was in a bigger mess than we ever could imagine. If it wasn't Osas would still be here and there would be no problem in the post. I also believe that when Price left for Grambling and Paulino left for Fresno State, we didn't get as high level of assistants as those two. Price kept Osas motivated and after Price left, Osas went south in a hurry. Maybe it is a combination of poor recruits and inadequate coaching. I think a case can be made for both. It has gotten so bad under Knight I really don't care. I'm ok if we keep him another year so I can bash him another year on here. I disagree with West, however. I absolutely DO NOT want Tic Price to be our coach. He had a decent year or two at UNO and that's pretty much it. Plus he's got that sex scandal in his background. Let's keep Knight until he quits. Then go hire some 2A high school coach to take his place. In the meantime, I'll save a little money by not having to go to basketball games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagle eye Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 There is a lot of back and forth about whether PK should go but to base it on a Bob West column bothers me. His blind hatred of Jerry Jones and putting the blame solely on Jones for Jimmy Johnson leaving the Cowboys after two Super Bowl wins in a row borders on the ridiculous. West has a HUGE man-crush on Jimmy Johnson and West has spent since Jones bought the team in 1989 to now bashing "Jethro". I personally don't like West's journalism style and he flat sucks on the Friday Night Experience calling football games. This is not a personal attack on West as a person because I don't know the man but I've read his column for a number of years and he's just not my cup of tea. Bob West is echoing the sentiments of many here on BRI. I know that a lot of people want PK gone I just don't think the spokesman in this case is all that great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBonesLU Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 There is a lot of back and forth about whether PK should go but to base it on a Bob West column bothers me. His blind hatred of Jerry Jones and putting the blame solely on Jones for Jimmy Johnson leaving the Cowboys after two Super Bowl wins in a row borders on the ridiculous. West has a HUGE man-crush on Jimmy Johnson and West has spent since Jones bought the team in 1989 to now bashing "Jethro". I personally don't like West's journalism style and he flat sucks on the Friday Night Experience calling football games. This is not a personal attack on West as a person because I don't know the man but I've read his column for a number of years and he's just not my cup of tea. Bob West is echoing the sentiments of many here on BRI. I know that a lot of people want PK gone I just don't think the spokesman in this case is all that great. Well said. As for me, I'm on the "let him stay" side. Firing a guy after two bad horrible seasons seems like a no-brainer for a coach who has brought no success to a program, but that just isn't the case. Roc was a great recruiter, and we saw that with the likes of Kenny Dawkins, Mike James, and Lamar Sanders as well as a few others. However, he couldn't win with his teams. Knight came in and won the conference the first season he was here with Roc's talented recruits. That has earned him a reprieve in my book for the time being. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachacola Posted February 10, 2014 Author Share Posted February 10, 2014 What bothers me about this whole deal is that Pat Knight was given a more money and a larger budget than Roc, but Roc was able to recruit better talent and win a lot more than 3 games a year. Pat Knight takes Roc's group of seniors and was able to parlay that into a $200K salary and extension BEFORE he could prove he could win with his own players!! Roc was fired in part because he missed the SLC tourney 2 years in a row. Looks like Pat Knight is going to equal that PLUS manage to win less games in 2 years than Roc did in his worst year (even after subtracting the sub-D1 cupcakes). Yes, Pat Knight took the team to the NCAAs, but it was a play-in game and they lost!! 6'9 Michale Kyser is playing pretty well over at La Tech (he was the WAC defensive player of the year last year), and he'd be in a LU uniform if Roc hadn't been fired. I think Lamar should hire another guy like Roc, an assistant from a big school that knows how to recruit (it seems to be working really well for SFA this year), but make sure he knows his Xs and Os too!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puddin tane Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Tic Price......history of banging coeds and alleged assaults?...thanks but I'll pass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austin badbyrd Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 If you replace Knight, at least get a coach who can recruit and has D1 experience. Maybe off the staff of Tom Izzo, Coach K, or John Thompson III. Yeah I know I'm aiming high, but why shouldn't we get the best from the best? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geezer Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Sorry fellas, there are no guarantees. PK was a top assistant for one of the all time great coaches. Roc was a top assistant and recruiting coordinator from a top program at Memphis when Tubbs brought him to Bmt. Whether PK is here or gone, there probably won't be more than two or three spots open and I would imagine not more than two. The NCAA rules for athletes progressing to graduation will prevent anyone from forcing too many players out as it could cause LU to loose scholarships in the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badndn Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Good points Geezer. What about a JUCO success? or Someone in DII or NAIA? or Do they just pay dearly for a prooven winner at a low DI competitor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachacola Posted February 11, 2014 Author Share Posted February 11, 2014 The difference between Roc and PK is that Roc had never been a HC before he took over at Lamar. PK had been the HC at Tech and was fired after 2 or 3 seasons. Roc was known as a recruiter, PK was known as Bob Knight's son. Geezer, you're right, there are no guarantees, except maybe that Lamar will once again make the wrong hire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingSnake Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Well said. As for me, I'm on the "let him stay" side. Firing a guy after two bad horrible seasons seems like a no-brainer for a coach who has brought no success to a program, but that just isn't the case. Roc was a great recruiter, and we saw that with the likes of Kenny Dawkins, Mike James, and Lamar Sanders as well as a few others. However, he couldn't win with his teams. Knight came in and won the conference the first season he was here with Roc's talented recruits. That has earned him a reprieve in my book for the time being. I'd much rather have a good recruiter that wants to be here (like ROC) that isn't so great with X & O's than a lousy recruiter that is a malcontent, regardless of how good a X & O guy he is. No matter how good a coach you are supposed to be, if you can't recruit, you can't win. PK obviously doesn't like it here. He thought we would be his stepping stone. Instead, he is subject failure, and has destroyed what was left of the basketball program. Bob West's message is spot on, even if you don't like the messenger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badndn Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Knight came in and won the conference the first season he was here with Roc's talented recruits. Actually PK did not win the conference. LU finished third in the Conference behind UTA and SFA. Which to me is the biggest bunch of BS in college basketball today. Why play 16 games to decide in one weekend who represents your conference in the big dance? Roc actually won the Conference in 2008. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachacola Posted February 12, 2014 Author Share Posted February 12, 2014 Knight came in and won the conference the first season he was here with Roc's talented recruits. Actually PK did not win the conference. LU finished third in the Conference behind UTA and SFA. Which to me is the biggest bunch of BS in college basketball today. Why play 16 games to decide in one weekend who represents your conference in the big dance? Roc actually won the Conference in 2008. Roc wins the conference with his players but doesn't get a raise or extension, while Knight comes in third but wins the SLC tourney (and NCAA bid) with Roc's players so he gets a 2 year extension and raise. Where is the logic in that? And now we're stuck with a even worse coach than Roc who gets paid more!! To me it looks like the athletic department screwed up really bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LUSportsFan Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 I think we all contributed. At least I did. I thought we were on the way back. At the time, I didn't find anything wrong with the Athletic Department's moves. I knew that we had rebuilding to go through, but expected that there would be a progression of improvement (wishful thinking??). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badndn Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Yes. I think with PK it was thought he would bolt after a few good years so we better pony up to try and keep him, but no one really expected Roc to move on for another HC gig so no need to overpay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cardinalrule Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Knight came in and won the conference the first season he was here with Roc's talented recruits. Actually PK did not win the conference. LU finished third in the Conference behind UTA and SFA. Which to me is the biggest bunch of BS in college basketball today. Why play 16 games to decide in one weekend who represents your conference in the big dance? Roc actually won the Conference in 2008. Roc wins the conference with his players but doesn't get a raise or extension, while Knight comes in third but wins the SLC tourney (and NCAA bid) with Roc's players so he gets a 2 year extension and raise. Where is the logic in that? And now we're stuck with a even worse coach than Roc who gets paid more!! To me it looks like the athletic department screwed up really bad. Roc never won the conference? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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