Price might be right for Lamar

[Knightman]

If that is what ends up happening, I will support him as I did for Patrick!!!!!!!! Because I am here to support Lamar and all it's teams!!!!!!!!!

 

Go Lamar!!!!!!!!

 

Knightman

[Cardinalrule]

We're just speculating on who would want Price as head coach. If I donated 400k so Lamar could hire a better coach I would want thrm to hire the very best. I want the prez and the AD to actually search for the best guy and not pretend to with the intention all along to hire Price. I think they will try to hire the best guy.

 

I sure hope you are right. If Price is the best option out there, that doesn't speak too highly of the coaching profession.

[NorthoftheBorder]

I have been a fan and alumnus for close to 40 years, and for basketball we only got it right 2 times during that span, Tubbs - only because he was an a very talented alumnus and former player, and Foster - we actually did a "real search" without trying to do our normal "good ole boy" screw up dog and pony show search. Abatemarco was a national search that just went wrong. I have almost zero faith that we will get this right this time. Too much influence from "power brokers" who truly are not qualified to make such a big decision!!!

[eagle eye]

I'm not sure about the 'power broker' fear. Do we think that the AD is handcuffed by alumni? Do we think Bob West has a big sway over the search process? We just as guilty of the same crap Jerry Jones was guilty of for so long after Jimmy Johnson left, and that is trying to get off on the cheap for his coaching staff. Jones ego was bruised and he tried for almost 10 years to get along with a half-assed string of coaches trying to prove he didn't need Johnson. Lamar isn't missing on coaches because of bruised egos but poor judge of talent that's killing us. Don't you think that PK was hired on name value to a large extent, especially after he was so bad a Texas Tech after his dad left. What the search committee needs are people who aren't looking solely at money but they need to look at the coaches body of work. There are several threads here addressing who could be a good coaching candidate. I don't want a guy like Price who has a checkered past and I don't want to see an assistant with no head coaching experience hired either. We've gone down that road with Abatemarco. It would be great if we got a guy in his early 40's who could be considered a long term answer. I don't really care about age so much but a guy who can relate to potential recruits is a must. Not only does a college coach need to be good at x's and o's and game management he has to sell himself and the school to high school and JC players, and their parents, who will make the team successful. So, the title of this thread is a double edged sword. Is Price the right guy or is the price of Price right for Lamar? If we're hiring solely on what the coach will accept for a salary then we're not going to be happy with the result. It's like an NFL team drafting solely by need. Rarely does either situation work out well.

[NorthoftheBorder]

You seem to have a keen eye over the last 20+ years of Jerry Jones the GM/Head Coach of the Cowgirls and the mediocre at best results by looking in fact at the results, not the hyperbole!!! Go back and look over the last 30+ years of Lamar BB coach hires. If you have been around the program like I was from the early 80's until the early 2000's and observed what was going on with the hiring decisions maybe you would come to the same conclusion!!

[LUSportsFan]

I'm not sure about the 'power broker' fear. Do we think that the AD is handcuffed by alumni? Do we think Bob West has a big sway over the search process? We just as guilty of the same crap Jerry Jones was guilty of for so long after Jimmy Johnson left, and that is trying to get off on the cheap for his coaching staff. Jones ego was bruised and he tried for almost 10 years to get along with a half-assed string of coaches trying to prove he didn't need Johnson. Lamar isn't missing on coaches because of bruised egos but poor judge of talent that's killing us. Don't you think that PK was hired on name value to a large extent, especially after he was so bad a Texas Tech after his dad left. What the search committee needs are people who aren't looking solely at money but they need to look at the coaches body of work. There are several threads here addressing who could be a good coaching candidate. I don't want a guy like Price who has a checkered past and I don't want to see an assistant with no head coaching experience hired either. We've gone down that road with Abatemarco. It would be great if we got a guy in his early 40's who could be considered a long term answer. I don't really care about age so much but a guy who can relate to potential recruits is a must. Not only does a college coach need to be good at x's and o's and game management he has to sell himself and the school to high school and JC players, and their parents, who will make the team successful. So, the title of this thread is a double edged sword. Is Price the right guy or is the price of Price right for Lamar? If we're hiring solely on what the coach will accept for a salary then we're not going to be happy with the result. It's like an NFL team drafting solely by need. Rarely does either situation work out well.

 

Unless priorities have changed in the athletic department, I don't know if it would be so much a case of "trying to get off on the cheap". Comparing average head coaching salaries, Lamar is behind only Oral Roberts in our conference in average salaries for men's head coaches. We're pretty close to Oral Roberts. Their average is around $3,000 per year more than ours. Expanding the comparison, the Lamar average for men's head coaches is also higher than 6 current or incoming Sun Belt member schools.

 

I think the issue is more a matter of finding the right fit and making a good selection. That's why I would be very disappointed if the selection process is only a "wave of the hand window dressing" type of search.

 

Data source is the US Department of Education "Equity in Data Analysis Cutting Tool". (I bookmarked that link after Coachacola commented on the updated data in a fairly recent post.)

 

Keep in mind, the comparison is merely a snapshot. The comparison period is for 2013 reporting so incoming Sun Belt members may increase (as may the other universities). Even so, it does indicate that historically, Lamar has not been an "on the cheap" program when compared with equivalent programs. (I only looked at men's head coaching averages because the current search is for a men's basketball coach.)

 

I wouldn't rule out assistant coaches. I think it is more a matter of getting the correct one. Hopefully a diligent search will achieve that goal. A couple of other former assistant coaches that had success here were Billy Tubbs and Pat Foster. Tubbs did have a head coaching job for a couple of years at a NAIA school (now DIII), Southwestern University. After his two year stint at Southwestern he returned to assistant coaching jobs at D-I programs before coming to Lamar. Foster was an assistant coach before coming to Lamar.

 

Here's the link again if anyone wants to play with it. There's a lot of good information in the database.

 

http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/

 

[eagle eye]

I stand corrected for the "on the cheap" comment but the futility of our head coaching decisions over the last 2 decades has been a little bit to be desired and I'm sure we can pretty much agree on that. As for the "not ruling out assistants" part of your post I need to clarify a bit. I don't want a guy like Abatemarco who had no previous head coaching experience. I think when Lamar hired him he really thought he was just like Jim Valvano who he served as an assistant at NC State. Time has shown he is no Jimmy V. That was my point. Hire an assistant who has experience running a program. As some have pointed out a D-II or NAIA head coach understands the college game and what it takes to recruit, etc could be a viable option as long as he has been successful. The bottom line is, I just want the basketball program to be successful. I am not sure about what the past coaches were making but I bet Grey Giovani and Coach Rock weren't breaking the bank. PK got his money on name value but the results are obviously not what we needed. Some credit has to go to Coach Rock because he did do some good things. If PK had CR recruiting for him he might still be here.

[geezer]

If LU goes with Price, it would potentially open a few dollars as he is already on the payroll. It depends on what they do with the position he was fulfilling. When Billy Tubbs replaced Deane, Lamar didn't replace him as AD, as Tubbs never intended to coach but a few years and then turn the reigns over to Roc. Point is LU went four years counting the year that Tidwell was AD without filling all of the posistions.

[woodman]

I am not sure if Price is right for the job but one thing I noticed the first game he took over. HE DRESSED LIKE A D1 HEAD COACH. I know it probably didn't matter to a lot of folks but it burnt my butt to see PK & staff come out with that casual look while the visiting coaches were dressed nice. To me his casualness reflected his attitude and work ethic toward the BB system and community. He was casual about coaching, recruiting, working and every other aspect of the program. I was told he was very lazy and did not help in any fundraisers other than show up like a celebrity. Just saying I think looking the part goes a long way in projecting how you approach the job.

[geezer]

While I agree that PK seemed to be too casual, there may be a happy medium. I don't see why the trainers or other non paid staff need to wear suits. Maybe the sport shirts would have seemed alright if he had been active on the sideline.

[Card Nation]

Price wearing a suit as opposed to khaki's tells me that Price cares and respects his current position as head coach. I'm not big on what people wear either way, but it tells me that he didnt have a say under knight, and that he respects his job, respects his players, respects the community he is in and is grateful for the opportunity to be interim head coach. And most importantly he appears to be rubbing off on the players in a good way.

 

With regard to the 'affair' , i dont like it. However, None of my personal relationships have been like two people in love , holding hands under a big oak tree, breeze in our hair, frolicking in daisies. At least not for long anyway. Stuff happens. Point is relationship screw ups are not a crime as long as she is old enough. :).

 

In addition, i have heard he 'iS' a good man which is what i would want at a minimum representing Lamar.

[coachacola]

More from everyone's favorite sportswriter:

 

It's difficult to envision Lamar University not naming Tic Price head basketball coach within the next 48 hours. Beyond the fact it's financially expedient, given the $400,000 payout to Pat Knight, and Price already being on Lamar's payroll, Tic earned the opportunity with an impressive body of work after taking over a team that was a hopeless mess. He not only coached hard, he worked his tail off recruiting, without guarantees he was going to get the job. In a perfect world, Tic wouldn't be my choice over three coaches with Lamar ties - Steve Green, Alvin Brooks and Tom Abatemarco - who want the job, but it isn't a perfect world. Hire Tic. The man is hungry and he's proven he can coach

 

http://www.panews.com/sportsbobwest/x1984782552/West-column-Wade-preparing-to-become-an-opera-critic?mobRedir=false

 

 

[geezer]

A couple of things that come from West's comments, we now know who the four coaches LU can hire that won't be criticized initially in the PA News and since Tic Price was available to help Roc learn to coach, Roc might have been uncoachable. Maybe that's why Skelton left and the LU record went down for Roc's final three seasons.

[NorthoftheBorder]

I disagree, I would go with Green but what do I know. One thing for sure, I will not be consulted, LOL!!! Lazeek may have influence but not sure if that makes a difference or is a bad or good thing!!

[LAZEEK]

Ugh. I have no influence. I just have a few connections on what may or may not be taking place. ;) ;)

[geezer]

I say get a really big donor to pay a few million to steal a coach from a high profile program.

[badndn]

I say get a really big donor to pay a few million to steal a coach from a high profile program.

You shouldn't post under the influence. ;D

[eagle eye]

Hey Coachacola, am I going to have to avoid your posts? You keep posting Bob freaking West columns and he has nothing to say I agree with. The column you liked was crammed with Cowboy bashing crap. It's not even Cowboy bashing it's the long standing hatred for Jerry Jones West has had since West's man-love, Jimmy Johnson, quit coaching the Cowboys. All that water should be under the bridge since both men have made up and admitted they were both wrong. Hell, even Troy Aikman said the team was pissed at both men because they had always asked the team to sacrifice for the good of the team and those two couldn't, or wouldn't, do the same for the good of the Cowboys. The Cowboys aren't the only team or entity he's spewed his particular type of venom on. He has managed to bash every coach in every sport at some time or another and the people he likes seem to get a free pass from all their transgressions.

Coach, if your a Price man, that's cool. His transgressions are not ones that hurt or were directed at his players. He fooled around with a woman who wasn't his wife. This is no Jerry Sandusky here. The woman was of legal age but she was a student. A definite no-no for teachers and coaches who hope to keep their jobs. Price is a guy who has had success in D-1 basketball and if Bobby Petrino can get a second chance then why not Price? Certainly Price isn't the tool bag Petrino is. I originally didn't want Price for a head coach but the more research I do on him I'm thinking he wouldn't be a terrible choice. But, I abjectly refuse to say I agree one bit with anything Boob West has to say.

[baller]

Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

[geezer]

Hey coach, why lock the other message? I am not offended by people that don't know public funds aren't spent on athletics in Texas universities.

[coachacola]

Hey coach, why lock the other message? I am not offended by people that don't know public funds aren't spent on athletics in Texas universities.

 

There was too much name calling going on and I didn't want that thread getting out of hand. Nothing wrong with a new thread talking about budgets and stuff without all the name calling.

[baller]

So donations typically have to be used in the area designated.Some game playing can be done like lowering budgets in an area where donations are made but that is not done as often as doubters would believe..The athletic department is funded by the state,university,student voted fees,ticket sales ,donations,suite sales,concessions,parking,guarantee games mostly from men's basketball and football ,NCAA ,media sales,advertising,organization fundraising and fees,etc.Non revenue producing sports like men's and women's golf coaching salaries,travel,scholarships,tournament expenses etc. are covered in part by the school .Athletic support and facility personnel are paid by the school. The school gets some funding from the state which is not as high a per cent as it was a decade ago.State and school funding does support Lamar athletics.In some other states ticket sale formulas have required universities remit part of ticket sales back to the state .If state and university funds are not used to support directly or indirectly athletics please tell me how a university in Texas or Louisiana balances its athletic budget.By the way when I visited Fresno State years ago I was told they raised money to endow their athletic scholarships reducing financial demands on the athletic department.Join the Cardinal Club.

[LUSportsFan]

Below is a link to the FAQ page for the Cardinal Club. Some numbers may be dated, but the information is good.

 

The thing that sold me is that the main emphasis is on athletic scholarships. It looks like Cardinal Club donations don't come close to fully funding all our athletic scholarships, but every bit can help. Also, the more we can cover on the scholarship side means there would be more of the revenue from other sources available for other needs and improvements.

 

It looks like membership levels are set up so that just about everyone can be a participant without breaking the bank.

 

http://www.lamarcardinals.com/cardinal-club/cardinal-club-did-you-know.html

 

Sent from my Android device using Tapatalk2